Weight Watchers Points Plus Program

looks like Weight Watchers is making some changes in their points system. No longer will a calorie be a calorie. Some calories will be more equal than others!

Will be interesting to see what the real effect of this will be...

http://blog.peertrainer.com/tip_of_the_day/2010/11/weight-watchers-new-program-2011.html

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Monday, December 25, 2006, 1:00 PM

seems like ww is making a big deal about something that most of us already know- a serving of spinach is a much better choice than a slice of low carb bread. how is this new or different from what we all know?

Friday, November 19, 2010, 8:20 PM

I went to Weight Watchers meetings for over a year and people did not seem to know this! I'm really glad to hear that they are making these changes because I just couldn't keep going to the meetings as they talked about getting in your servings of dairy and olive oil, let alone the processed garbage they are selling to people as food.

Thursday, November 25, 2010, 3:33 PM

Recipes to help you lose weight

Tuesday, November 30, 2010, 8:08 AM

VERY disappointing to learn the details of the new Weight Watchers Points Plus. They summarize the program by saying increase protein and decrease carbs and fat. This is Atkins lite. We know that Atkins works in the short term but is terrible for your health in the long term.

What they SHOULD have done is had a big arrow that pointed people to greens. This is an obvious $$ move because people like to do things like Atkins (lose weight by eating steak!!) and have a harder time eating greens. So this will definitely help them sell more programs.

Tuesday, November 30, 2010, 11:55 AM

A calorie isn't a calorie as your body metabolises macros, not calories, and the macros determine the hormonal response for either fat, carb or protein, as they are all different.

It's a far cry from Atkins light.I find most people who throw out the word Atkins as if it's a bad thing usually haven't actually read the book at all.

The fact is that it's those carbs that require the most insulin and keep your blood sugar high, leading to diabetes. Atkins done properly doesn't damage your health- quite the contrary. Pretending to do Atkins only on weekdays, or failing to appreciate the carbs in food is what damages your health- high fat, high protein, high carb- that's the standard American diet and that's what's causing obesity. I know people on Atkins who eat more veggies than vegetarians.

If anything, it's probably closer to south beach. Classic diet advice is 60% of your calories from carbs, and South beach advocates 40%- which to many doesn't make it so much 'low carb' as moderate carb.

I find it odd though that veggies and fruits are unlimited regardless of either their GI or carb count... It's about time though that someone is suggesting that 100 cals of potato chips shouldn't be chosen over 100 cals of a whole food.

Tuesday, November 30, 2010, 2:51 PM

I had a chance to look at their brochure- what is disturbing about the new Points Plus is that Weight Watchers has these huge arrows. One arrow pointing up to Protein and Fiber and another pointing down to carbs and. There may be some hidden benefit somewhere in there- meaning that maybe the protein in greens are promoted in someway because they are high in protein and low in fat-- I HOPE!!--
but the average person can only digest so much information at once, and the vast majority of people fail at Weight Watchers long term. So- in their mind, they are going to only think "protein good"-- which is really a license to eat Atkins. Too much meat is really not good- according to what I have read you want your meat consumption to be about 10% of your total calories.

Looking forward to more input, hope that I am wrong in my assessment. If I am correct, the new WW system could be a nutritional disaster in terms of the unintended consequences of their advice.

Wednesday, December 1, 2010, 11:28 AM

Disagree re Atkins Lite

I think the carb watching idea stems from the fact that it's easy to fill up on non-nutritive or low nutrient carb items (cereal, cereal bars, snack bars, etc) versus eating whole high-nutrient foods. This isn't a license to fill up on pepperoni and cheese and mayo (a la Atkins).

I think it's a good idea and I'd like to learn more. You can still eat as healthy as you like! We should all be avoiding all kinds of carb-loaded pre-fabbed "diet" and "health' foods anyway.

Wednesday, December 1, 2010, 11:58 AM

Vaggies carbs

Just read that veggies aren't "counted" towards your carb count. If this is true, you can eat vegetables all day long! Clearly this isn't ATkins at all--this is an effort to get people away from the processed crap and point them towards foods with higher nutritional value.

And I TOTALLY agree with the PP who mentioned that 100 calories of broccoli isn't equal to 100 calorie snack pack. Glad WW is paying attention to current nutritional thinking. These silly snack packs are just making people heavier and less healthy.

Wednesday, December 1, 2010, 12:02 PM

Free Fruits

I heard that the new program makes most (maybe all?) fruits free. This is cleary not Atkins.

Wednesday, December 1, 2010, 6:58 PM

they are paying lip service to fruits and vegetables. Who does not know these are good for the? Nobody. The core of the new Weight Watchers Points Plus are "power foods"- which include lots of meat and dairy.

These power foods are considered the "healthiest" by the company. The problem with this is that people already get plenty of meat and dairy. You don't need weight watchers to encourage you to eat more meat and dairy.

This is a license to eat Atkins for the 95% of people who will start and stop Weight Watchers. All they will remember is "meat and dairy are powerfoods"

This will KILL people in the long run- more heart attacks and disease. That may not be Weight Watchers intention, but it will be the result because WW is not taking human psychology into consideration.

Thursday, December 2, 2010, 8:29 PM

Whats wrong with lean beef or dairy? They are healthy foods.

Thursday, December 2, 2010, 8:48 PM

Alternative To The Weight Watchers Points System

you get what you incentivize. Americans already eat plenty of meat and dairy- this is in the context of a diet that is literally killing us. Weight Watchers is now officially endorsing AND incentivizing the status quo. Period. They are flashing a green light for increased meat and dairy consumption.

Weight Watchers knows exactly what they are doing- Atkins is easy. And they know it. If you want an advanced points system, walk into your nearest Whole Foods, and go to the produce section. It is printed all over the place. You can also read about the Points System that Whole Foods endorses at this page:

Healthy Alternative To The Weight Watchers Points System

Thursday, December 2, 2010, 9:10 PM

WW PP

I don't think some folks here understand the new program. The Power Foods include fruits, non-starchy vegetables, whole grains, non-fat dairy and lean protein. The new program is designed to encourage people to choose plant-based items first, to increase fiber intake and satisfaction. This is about as far from Atkins as it could be. I'm not sure where the hostility about this sensible program comes from.

Thursday, December 2, 2010, 9:46 PM

I don't know what your talking about! I heard milk is gonna cost more points now, and I love my weight watcher shakes

Friday, December 3, 2010, 8:15 AM

It's a high grain high carb diet that is killing this world, not protein and dairy. It's eating processed foods including abonimations like tofurkey that are causing health problems.

Anyone suggesting the new WW is like Atkins, quite simply does not know anything correct about Atkins, and probably shouldn't be speaking about it.

Friday, December 3, 2010, 10:20 AM

power foods on weight watchers points plus program

I think what the previous posters are trying to say is that there is a difference between the surface and the substance of the new program. The substance might be great- but the main highlights of the power foods on weight watchers points plus program show big arrows towards protein and away from carbs and fat. People process information in relation to other things they see and know- and these signals look similar to atkins and south beach.

According to ww avocado is not on the power foods list. But lunch meats are. You go into the grocery store with that in mind and out go the avocados from your cart and in go the cold cuts.

Saturday, December 4, 2010, 9:56 PM

Gee it's the substance of the program you follow. Actually, I don't think you will find a healthier program, all the i's are dotted. I was wondering if anyone completed a week on the new program yet? I am eating a small portion of fruits or veggie's at every meal. I fell great! but , will I lose? I'll let you know.

Sunday, December 5, 2010, 10:50 AM

I love Weight Watchers

Let me start out by saying I love weight watchers and have lost a lot of weight. I do struggle with about 15 pounds still but compared to what I used to be, Weight watchers has changed my life. I've been a member for 5 years. What is confusing me is this: the Points system seems to change every year. One year I'm being told to eat one thing, the next year, I'm being told something else. I don't understand what to do. What if I learn the entire new Points Plus system because it's new, but it's different than what I was doing, and then next year, I'll be doing something else? What's the right thing to do? What is the right weight watchers points system? Will I be ok if I just do what I did the last few years? And if I change it, am I going to be told it's wrong next year?

Monday, December 6, 2010, 10:53 AM

I guess if the old program works, keep using it. It's certainly easier since you don't need a calculator to figure out points values. That said, encouraging fruits and veggies by lowering points is a good thing. Changing the program every few years can be frustrating. After having most of the points values memorized in my head, and having a pretty good idea how to estimate, now I have to start over again. On the other hand, it gives me the opportunity to re-evaluate everything.

Bottom line - there good and bad.

Monday, December 6, 2010, 6:11 PM

a glass of wine used to be 2 points and now it is 4 points. Makes sense because wine= more eating, especially the morning after.

How To Make Good Choices

Wednesday, December 8, 2010, 10:41 AM

weight watchers PointsPlus

This new program is fabulous! Whole carbs, good fats, and lean proteins, along with free fruit and most veggies free steers peoole in the right direction. Best of all, you never have to be hungry on this program and with all the free whole foods, such as fruit, greens, and low-carb veggies. This is definitely NOT Atkins-lite. This is sanity-plus! You can be on any number of eating styles with this new and improved WW, but the more whole foods you go, the more satisfied and nourished you are. This is their best program yet! Dr. Fuhrman's eating program would fit right in to this!

Saturday, December 25, 2010, 1:19 AM

saw this in the WW community:

http://community.weightwatchers.com/Blogs/ViewPost.aspx?threadID=1261704

"I have given this new points plus a whole week and I can honestly say that I HATE the new program. I know those are harsh words to use but I have really struggled this week to make it work. I feel like I am all of a sudden on the atkins diet...which I quit years ago because I could not do it. I am having to eat less and that is causing me to be starving all the time. Not only am I hungry all the time, but I am using so many points during the day that I am going to bed every night feeling guilty and mad at myself. I dont like being able to only fit in 2 small meals for a day...and I am not eating bad with those two meals but its not cutting it.

For example, yesterday I had a subway ham and cheese sub for breakfast...then for lunch I at the other half of my ham and cheese sandwich. When I was done with breakfast and lunch (from a healthy restaurant no doubt) I only had 1 point left for dinner...what a crock! I am just devistated!"

nice lunch and breakfast! Dr. Atkins would be proud....

Sunday, December 26, 2010, 8:56 AM

Weight Watchers

I'm going to follow the old WW points program because I can't afford to go to WW now to get the books for the new program.
If the old program works for you, why not continue following it?
I'm going to use it as a guide becasue without it, I don't eat healthy.

Monday, December 27, 2010, 11:16 AM

Too bad the person posting on the WW board doesn't just turn to all the zero point fruits and vegetables available to them- there seems to be absolutely no reason the poster is barely eating anything and going hungry other than their particular food choices.

Monday, December 27, 2010, 12:48 PM

this is something that was posted in another thread:

"I have been in weight watchers for several years. The new system is very different and seems to emphasize high protein (meat) eating. I am a semi-vegetarian. When we were getting the new information it showed the difference between what you could eat. One was a pic of a croissant (on the bad) and, of all things, a slab of ham, a runny egg and 1/2 a piece of toast and butter (on the 'i get to eat this') side. It grossed me out.
Also, I work 60+ hours a day and I don't have time to learn a new system. I know very well what the points values are for items in the old system are. I don't want to change. It was healthy, high in fiber and low in fat. (My family has a Hx of colon cancer) And it was vegetarian friendly."

Here is a link to the full thread:

Link

Wednesday, December 29, 2010, 4:51 AM

After a few weeks...

The jury is still out for me on the new program. But I find it hard to believe that a PP was hungrier on this plan. I feel like I can eat a lot more especially since fruits are now free. I was at a daily target of 18 points with the old system and even fruit would make me go over, so I had very few options when I was hungry. Now I stuff my lunch bag with fruits so I always have an option.

All that said, I am frustrated that I have to use the calculator for everything. I pretty much knew or could "guess"-timate points values on everything and now I am starting all over again.

But the deciding factors for me will be whether I can stick to the plan and whether I will lose weight. Sticking to the plan takes an adjustment, but I feel comfortable that I can. As for losing weight... like I said... jury is out.

Wednesday, December 29, 2010, 3:32 PM

Weight Watchers Points Plus

I just started Weight Watchers in October on the old plan. Suddenly, after Thanksgiving, they are throwing something new at me! The old plan was working fabulously, but I gained weight after one week on the new Points Plus plan. The second week, I stayed the same. On the old plan, I was losing 2-3 lbs each week, and I wasn't hungry.

I, too, was starving on Points Plus. I used all my points before suppertime. My high-fiber cereal and milk in the morning went from 2-3 points to 7 points!!! My sandwich for work doubled in points, too! And you can't tell me that unlimited fruits and vegetables don't count---they certainly do! Of course, it's good to eat more fruits and vegetables, but having them cost 0 points in unrealistic.

The new Points Plus plan feels like a "DIET." The old plan felt like something I could do for the rest of my life. I might as well be on the old egg and grapefruit diet.

My feeling is that Weight Watchers wants us to lose weight more slowly, so we have to be paying members for a longer period of time, so they can make more money.

I also found that I was CRAVING carbohydrates on the Points Plus plan. Without cereal, bread, potatoes, etc., it found myself craving jumk food. When my weight loss stopped, I was ready to throw in the towel. Instead, I went back on the old plan. I lost 3.6 lbs this week, and I don't feel deprived any longer! Points Plus SUCKS!!!!!

Friday, December 31, 2010, 12:59 AM

Weight Watchers Points Plus

Part of the problem with Points Plus is that fruits just aren't satisfying to me unless I have a LOT of them, like a pound of grapes or three bananas. Vegetables satisfy a little better, but it is hard to bring vegetables to work, unless it is raw baby carrots, which gets old after a couple of days. I feel like this "diet" is forcing me to eat in a way that just doesn't work with my life.

Friday, December 31, 2010, 1:04 AM

Points Plus

I don't understand the assignment of daily points on the Points Plus. They told me on the old plan that as I lost weight, my daily points allotment would drop. Now, the lowest is 29 points. How can 29 points be right for me at 200 lbs, and also right for me at 150 lbs?

Another problem is recipes. Supposedly, most vegetables are 0 points. But what if I make a beef stew? I used to add the total calories, fat, and fiber, and divide by the number of servings to get a points value. Do I count points for the vegetables I add to the stew? It's very confusing.

Friday, December 31, 2010, 1:10 AM

Points Plus Calculator

I was experimenting with the new Points Plus calculator. I used 360 calories of fat only (which would be 40 grams), with no fiber. This comes out to 10 points. 360 calories of carbohydrates (90 grams) with no fiber comes out to 10 points, as well. 360 calories of protein (90 grams) with no fiber comes out to 8 points. I found that adding fiber to each one didn't change the points at all until the fiber count got up to 10-12 grams--then the points value went down by one point.

So it appears that, to Weight Watchers, carbohydrates and fat are equally bad. And it appears that fiber is no longer the good guy it used to be.

Friday, December 31, 2010, 1:15 AM

Points Plus

I've lost all my motivation now that they've started the Points Plus plan. It feels like they are setting us up to fail. My weight loss has slowed down, and I don't feel nearly as satisfied as I did before on the regular Points plan. I supposed I am eating healthier, but I am eating fruits and vegetables because they're free (0 points), not because I want them. Also, when I am running out of points at the end of the day, I find that I sometimes have to have a supper of just vegetables in order to stay within my points range.

Friday, December 31, 2010, 2:09 AM

But doesn't eating healthier mean something? If you're having a dinner full of vegetables because you've run out of points for other bad food, then aren't they doing something right?

Friday, December 31, 2010, 6:30 PM

No bad food

The I was eating wasn't "bad"--it just had carbs in it. Cereal in the morning, a sandwich at lunch, etc. They charge so many points for carbs that you have none left for supper.

If I could eat at home all the time, it wouldn't be a probably. I could cook a chicken breast and vegetables for every meal. Unfortunately, that's not the real world.

Friday, December 31, 2010, 7:27 PM

Going over on points

If you've used up all your points for the day, but then have fruit and vegetables to get you through the evening, you're going to be consuming calories, no matter if they are 0 points or not. Thus, you are not going to lose as much weight.

Friday, December 31, 2010, 7:29 PM

I am the same way. I can't eat at home every day either. How could you eat cereal in the morning, a sandwich for lunch and not have anything left at dinner? Is it really that restrictive?

To the other poster: if you eat fruits and vegetables at dinner, you're not going to gain weight. There is such thing as good calories and bad calories.

Friday, December 31, 2010, 8:26 PM

Points Plus Gear On Amazon

New Weight Watchers Points Plus Calculators On Amazon

Saturday, January 1, 2011, 2:15 PM

ww+

I am confused as to why one would be out of points after a subway sub. Even with cheese, the sub should have been around 10 points for 6 inches. Multiplied by 2, that is 20. At minimum you should have 29 daily points and another 49 points in weekly flex points. That leaves 9 points for the day alone without even going into the flex points.

Tuesday, January 4, 2011, 10:56 AM

Points

Even though some foods (high carb) have gone up in points, the new program is supposed to give you more points per day than on the old program. Maybe the people running out of points by the end of the day haven't recalculated their daily points.
Also, my doctor actually recommended this lifestyle of eating as the best diet plan. New research suggests that eating certain types of carbs, like refined sugar and white flour actually stimulate appetite. Any food that produces a spike in blood sugar (high glycemic index foods) should be avoided (not forbidden, but eaten infrequently). Foods higher in fiber and protein are more satisfying and require more energy to digest. As long as fat content adds points, it should discourage eating fat-laden protein, but allow for lean proteins (chicken breasts, lean cold cuts, beans, tofu, low-fat dairy, etc.)
I am surprised that not one comment here mentioned the benefits of adding in physical activity to complement your diet. Both the old and the new program encourage this! So don't forget, if you want more points in your day then add in some exercise. Even a 30 min. brisk walk will allow for a satisfying dinner at the end of the day!

Friday, January 7, 2011, 6:17 AM

Adjust already

So I have not done WW's for a few years, but I remember when I started what an adjustment it really was. Reading everyone's feedback, I think people forget they are doing something new again. When I started WW's, I used all my points and was HUNGRY... once I mastered how and what to eat, when to eat, etc. I would go to bed and have a lot of points on the table. I had to FORCE myself to eat because I wasn't consuming enough. I think everyone really needs to remember that.

So veggies are free and at the end of the day you have very few points or are hungry. Toss those few points in for some cheese or meat or a 1/4 cup of milk and you can make some amazing veggie casseroles etc. I think the problem with everyone upset is that you're addiction is junk (pirates booty might have been low point but it was still junk food.) I love my carbs and crunch foods. Toss some diced zucchini with some bread crumbs and spices and in a skillet with a dash of olive oil and you feel like you're eating something bad that's still quite healthy. It might take time, but you'll figure out a routine.

Friday, January 7, 2011, 12:19 PM

WW Simply Filling Technique Points Plus

If you plan your meals around the Good Health Guidelines and the Power Foods you won't have much room left for junk food. WW also has another option called Simply Filling Technique. You get to eat all the foods on the Power Foods List plus have the 49 living pts for foods not on the Power Food list, you eat to satisfaction only. You let your real hunger level determine how much you eat. I works great and is very healthy and to top it off you lose weight. I've lost 75 lbs so far eating this way.

Friday, January 7, 2011, 2:39 PM

will probably quit

I have to weigh in tomorrow after 3 failed weeks on points plus...not to mention throwing a 5 lb gain over Christmas! This plan is hard to embrace. I keep telling myself-1 more week and I'll get motivated. Truth is in order for weight loss to be successful it has to be easy and sustainable. If eating tons of fruits and veggies were the answer there would be no overweight vegetarians out there and believe me I have met my share of chubby ones. An apple has calories but so does chocolate. The bad thing about this plan is you tend to have the chocolate AND the apple because the apple is free. Both are sugar in the end. Not sure if I'll continue with this or not...hate the thought of continuing to waste $16/week but I just don't seem to have the mindset to give this a go.

Friday, January 7, 2011, 8:02 PM

As a vegetarian, I have to commend on that last post.

Just because someone is a vegetarian DOES NOT mean they have a healthy diet. I know some vegetarians that survive on pasta, bread, peanut butter, I even have one vegetarian friend who doesn't like or eat vegetables! Often vegetarians have worse diets than meat eaters, filling up on processed "junk" veggie foods (think veggie dogs), so this statement of vegetarians not being thin is really irrelevant. There are meat eaters who eat a very health diet, and there are meat eaters that have a very high fat poor diet. The same is true of vegetarians.

I know from experience that a diet FULL of fruits and veg is the one way to lose weight without feeling hungry, and sustaining the weight loss.

This means, if you're having a salad with your lunch, make the portion size HUGE. It takes a lot of veggies to feel full, but trust me after a pound of salad there's no way in hell you'll be hungry.

Sunday, January 9, 2011, 6:07 PM

Well the fact is that both protein and fat are more satisfying than fibre- so a low carb diet is a great way to lose weight without feeling hungry.

The big problem is the reaction to a high carbohydrate high fat. High fat low carb works, low fat high carb works- but combining fat and carbs doesn't work well.

As is oft heard before, many vegetarians are just starchatarians... some can do it healthily, many do not.

Sunday, January 9, 2011, 10:15 PM

6:07- right on, that is exactly right. The nutrients in vegetables give your body what it needs from a nutrition standpoint. 10:15 is right as well, in addition to your greens sometimes a little extra protein and fat will give you fuel and help you feel good especially if you are active.

It's funny- if Weight Watchers came out and said "eat a whole bunch of vegetables, especially greens"- they would not have a business. Instead they need to create some complex system that is so hard to follow--- but it makes you think that you are getting something for all the money you are spending. $16 a week adds up. Imagine if you just spent $64 a month on greens? That would buy you one full pound of frozen organic greens from Whole Foods.

You could call that "A Pound Of Greens A Day Diet"--- I'd bet it would work better than Weight Watchers as well.... a ton better...

Monday, January 10, 2011, 12:36 PM

sorry- that would buy you a full pound EACH DAY! People complain that organic and greens are expensive. Cheaper than WW and tons better for you....

Monday, January 10, 2011, 12:37 PM

So how do you know when to decrease your daily points and extra weekly points on the new points plus system? Does anyone know the formula to determine your daily points on this new system?

Tuesday, January 18, 2011, 1:16 PM

*10:15 You are so wrong. The new WW is not just about adding veggies WW always pushed green vegetables . I don't know where you live, but her in NYC WW is 39.95 per month or you could pay $13 per meeting or less then $10 per week through your medical plan. I love the new WW. My cholesterol went down 30 points, my sugar went down 20 points not to mention I lost 30lbs. I eat protien, dairy, and fruits and veggies and whole grains everyday. WW is the best!

Tuesday, January 18, 2011, 10:39 PM

I was on WW years ago, and I remember their credo was (at least where I went to meetings) basically, there was a looong list of vegetables that were "Unlimited". You could have a much as these as you wanted -- I think this is a great thing to follow. I would think that their position has not changed from that. When I think of 'carbs' on a program like that, I am not thinking most vegetables. I'm thinking rice, potatoes, pasta, etc. and lo and behold, haven't I discovered that these are the items that will put the little spare tire around my waist immediately.

I have found this to be what I have taken the most from Peertrainer also. To fill my plate with veggies FIRST - and then the protein and starch, if served.
This fits ideally with my idea of a proper and sound diet, not just for losing weight, but for life.

-- Brodsteel

Thursday, January 20, 2011, 10:53 AM

Curious about points

Does anyone know ... how many points you get when. In other words, the old plan clearly laid out, if you are between this weight and this weight, you get this many points. I just signed up this morning, and didn't get to stay for the meeting, they just told me this is how many points you have. Looking to review materials tonight and possibly stop into a meeting on the weekend. thanks!

Thursday, January 20, 2011, 5:01 PM

Daily Points

Unlike the book I got when I was on the old points system, which told you how to calculate your daily point allotment, there is no chart in any of the books to tell you how to calculate your daily points now. My leaders at my meeting told me that my new daily allotment was 29 points (it had been 25 points). In fact, the lowest number of points you can have is 29 (they tell me it used to be 18). This is what I don't understand. I was over 200 lbs when they told me my new daily points limit of 29. How can it continue to be 29 points every day, even if I get down to 140 lbs? It just doesn't seem right. By the way, I have continued on the old plan and am using the old points system, so my daily total is now 23 points.

Saturday, January 22, 2011, 11:37 PM

Agree. I have lost 9 pounds on this for the month. I eat very healty. vege's, fruit 2 servings a day, lean protien and fat free/low fat dairy. Whole grains. I have a bad hip which makes walking very difficult. I love this new program. This is not Atkins at all. Read the program.

Monday, January 31, 2011, 9:21 AM

Weight Watchers PointsPlus program is fantastic! And it does not say decrease carbs and fat across the board. It says to eat whole carbs and healthy carbs and avoid processed carbs more. As for fat, it encourages eating healthy fats, the Omega 3s like olive oil. They also encourage eating nuts, for those not allergic. The biggest change is free fruit, which does not have to be counted, just eaten. I've been doing this new program for awhile and the longer I do it and the more time I spend tracking and understanding it, the more I feel it is the greatest thing ever! This new program means never feeling hungry, and you don't have to turn to carrot sticks and celery if you want something.

This new program nudges you more toward healthy, whole foods, and discourages snacking on junky stuff. BUT - if you want that stuff, you can have it, as long as you just fit it in. The program encourages treating yourself. It's impressive and for those who take the time to really get to know it, it is wonderful.

Monday, January 31, 2011, 10:22 AM

The formula is so complicated that they have to calculate it for you. Or get one of their calculators and do it yourself, or use the online tools calculator. There is no slide this time. It just can't be done. But they do sell a calculator you can do it with.

Monday, January 31, 2011, 10:31 AM

It works

I have been on it for a month. I have lost 9 pounds. I am not exercising, have a really bad hip issue. I eat 2 servings of fruit a day. Mostly vege's lean protien,low fat dairy and whole grains.

Monday, January 31, 2011, 3:07 PM

10:22- thanks WW marketing person! Just as an fyi, we take input seriously when people put their user names on their quotes.

Monday, January 31, 2011, 6:18 PM

What's the beef with 10:22's input!? Sounds like this person knows the new program well vs. making grand assumptions about it without actually trying it or really understanding it.

Thought your input was great, 10:22.

Monday, January 31, 2011, 7:34 PM

Avacados

I was just curious. Are avacados also point free?

Monday, February 7, 2011, 6:02 PM

PointsPlus

"So- in their mind, they are going to only think "protein good"-- which is really a license to eat Atkins."

This is a good point, and definitely something to remember. The biggest change in the points program is that most fruits and veggies are now free on the plan, and that wasn't the case previously. So when it's 9:30 at night, you have 3 points left, it was just as costly to have a small bowl of pretzels as it was to get a banana. Which would you choose?

Thursday, February 17, 2011, 8:19 AM

"So- in their mind, they are going to only think "protein good"-- which is really a license to eat Atkins."
NOT A GOOD POINT. For crying out loud, anything that allows free fruit is nowhere near eating Atkins. And Atkins is NOT a high protein diet.

Thursday, February 17, 2011, 1:43 PM

love WW

to a pp avocados are not free, but a power food because they are good for you...

I've been on WW for 9 weeks now and have lost 20.8lbs. I'm happy with this, it might seem slow, but I truly believe that I am changing my life, not just my weight.

Wednesday, February 23, 2011, 11:36 PM

losing weight on ww

I think it's great that you've lost 20 pounds on the program ! Way to go. So what are you doing that making you so successful? Are you exercising w/ following ww or just just following the program by itself? I've been on the program for 3 weeks and I lost 6 pounds. Let me know.

A wwatcher too.

Friday, February 25, 2011, 10:20 AM

People have to realize that different approaches will work for different people. Many people on PEERtrainer have done great on WW over the years. Others have gone the "full Fuhrman" approach. Others blend many different influences and approaches.

One observation about WW, and we think this is accurate, is that they want the most people possible to be able to "do" their system. It is an obvious point- we all want to help as many people as possible.

One thing we have done at PEERtrainer is to take a more aggressive approach towards greens. We think that green vegetables are such an important part of health and weight loss that people ought to be rewarded for eating them. We have shared this concern broadly (and publicly) and many have agreed with us.

Our view is that some of the aggressive plans like Fuhrman are really good for many, but that a lot of people are looking for something a little more forgiving.

So the Cheat System that we launched sort of aims to thread a middle ground. Much more focus on health than WW, but less restrictive than Fuhrman. This is the link to download the cheat system.

http://blog.peertrainer.com/tip_of_the_day/2011/02/the-peertrainer-cheat-system.html

We should note that we are friends and partners with Dr Fuhrman, and he strongly objects to our "fusion" approach to dieting. From his perspective, he deals with people at a disease state who need strong nutritional intervention.

Our program is NOT that. If you thrive structure, definitely check out WW. Their track record is proven. If you are in a bad situation health wise, definitely check out Dr. Fuhrman:

drfuhrman.com website

If you already know what you need to do, and you know portion control, you might do well using the Cheat System.

The most important thing is that you move forward and feel great about yourself.

-PEERtrainer

Tuesday, March 1, 2011, 4:27 PM

Cool! I'll check that out. Especially because it's free.

Wednesday, March 2, 2011, 4:14 PM

weight watchers points plus

I am giving Points Plus another try (I tried it, but went back to the old way). So far I have lost only a half of a pound. I absolutely cannot stay within my daily point allotment (29). I think I know why. I started keeping track of the calories, as well as the points. I reached 30 points at suppertime, but I always a want a snack at night, so I was bummed out because I was already over my points. But then I added up the calorie count for the day--it was just a little over 1000 calories! THAT IS VERY LOW! No wonder I am starving on this plan!

Years ago, when I was very into bodybuilding, I used to track calories, protein, fat, and carbohydrates. It got to be so time-consuming that I went back to just counting calories, while trying to eat more protein (which, back then, the mainstream diet gurus told you was a BAD thing!!). Well, this Points Plus is the same pain-in-the butt thing--tracking everything takes SO MUCH TIME! What a pain for busy people!

Friday, March 18, 2011, 4:50 PM

What are you eating that only adds up to 1000 caories?

Just curious because at 29 points, which is the lowest target, I'm not sure how you can consume all those points and have it add up to only 1000? Especially if you are eating some fruits and vegetables, which add calories but no points.

I suppose it's possible to consume less than 1000 calories if you eat the wrong things. But I could not find a way. (2 king sized Milky way bars = a little less than 1000 calories and equals 26 points)

Or 6 cups of diced chicken I30 points, 1060 calories) - that's about the closest I could come and it assumes you are eating no veggies, no fruits.

What foods are you eating?

Tuesday, March 22, 2011, 10:04 AM

What are you eating that only adds up to 1000 calories?

Since tracking is taking up so much of my time, my record for that day only tells points and calories. I ate something for 329 calories, which was 9 points. Then I had something for 30 calories (0 points) and 20 calories (0 points). Then I had something for 112 calories that was 6 points, something for 280 calories that was 7 points, something for 180 calories that was 5 points, and something for 100 calories that was 3 points. That comes to 30 points and 1051 calories. I think the 329 was a bowl of my homemade beef stew. I believe the 280 calories was a lean pocket. The 30 calories was probably a clementine, and the 20 calories may have been green beans. I'm not sure what the rest of it was.

Wednesday, March 23, 2011, 12:26 AM

I think that one of the purposes of the new points system is to help you get away from highly processed foods like Lean Pockets,. which will 'cost' you much of your daily budget. (And what the heck is in that stew?! I made a chicken pot pie with a pastry crust on the top and bottom that was fewer points per serving that than stew! )

If someone isn't interested in eating more whole foods vs. processed foods - the new WW program may not be for them. That's where just going back to calorie counting may feel like a better fit. Even with calorie counting, though, my experience has always been that I get more 'bang for my calorie buck' and experience fewer cravings and hunger when I choose real food over processed foods.

I"m like the pp, I find I get more than enough food with the 29 points. It's also easy to blow through them all I don't choose wisely!

Wednesday, March 23, 2011, 8:41 AM

Points Plus

Unfortunately, many of us can't afford or don't have time to always have the perfect foods in the house. Maybeif I had my own cook and personal shopper I would find this plan easier to live with.

The stew contained beef stew meat, carrots, peas, onions, low-fat cream of mushroom soup, and tomato soup. I added up all the ingredients (yes, all the calories, protein, fat, carbohydrates, and fiber--this added almost an hour to the prep time!). I need a livable plan, not some unrealistic move-star menu plan.

Wednesday, March 23, 2011, 5:12 PM

I was probly one of the ealier posters, I did not like the new plan. I quit for a month and came back. Now I do the simply filling verision, and I love it!

Thursday, March 24, 2011, 7:26 AM

Teh Simply Filling version?

I haven't been to a WW meeting in a few months, but that's new to me. What is it?

Thursday, March 24, 2011, 8:10 AM

To 5:12

I can appreciate that not everyone has time in their days to prepare their own food in a healthy manner. To be honest, if that's your sitaution, maybe goign the Jenny Craig or NutriSystem approach might be better for you. It will cost more to buy all their foods but if that's the lifestyle you need right now, maybe it's a better option for you.

For me, the WW plan works because I do have the flexibility to do my own cooking and have a wonderful husband who loves to cook too. It's a very rare occasion when we have processed foods.

Thursday, March 24, 2011, 8:15 AM

You don't need a lot of money to eat well and stock your home with good foods. I can easily buy a few staples and feed my family of four very well and that has a lot to do with planning ahead and moving to a way of eating that is very realistic and liivable - meals have become a lot more simple and better for us.

It's the convenient processed foods that drain my budget more than anything. We've become accustomed to not thinking about what we want to eat until it's time to eat and then in that moment - we want it as fast as possible. That always comes at a price. So, does not planning ahead. If I don't have a plan for how to eat I will spend SO much more at the grocery store regardless of the type of food I buy.

Like the pp said, if this is not for you - another plan may be the way to go. Or if you felt better with doing your own thing and counting calories do that, but it's not a flaw in WW. It's just that the new emphasis on nutrition may not jive with what you're willing or able to do.

Thursday, March 24, 2011, 9:19 AM

The reaction to the decision by Weight Watchers to make fruit zero points has been interesting.

Here is the reason we think that WW made the move, and who it benefits- and who it doesn't:

http://blog.peertrainer.com/diet/2011/03/why-is-fruit-now-unlimited-on-the-weight-watchers-points-plus-program.html

-PEERtrainer

Monday, April 4, 2011, 7:45 PM

PeerTrainer re: Fruits

After reading the article referenced in the above link, I have to admit that I am somewhat taken aback by some of the statements.

"Weight Watchers is an excellent tool for people who are just starting to get their eating and weight under control, and who are starting the process of making better food decisions. " I don't think this statement is at all accurate. How many Life Time Weight Watchers are out there? I have been doing WW for decades and I am not alone.

"That said, a lot of experts who deal with health, nutrition and peak performance recommend a limiting or even an elimination of fruit. " Really? The only "experts" that I have heard this from are those that promote high protein low carb diets like Atkins. With all the health benefits of fruits, I find it hard to believe that any nutritional expert would advise eliminating fruits.

Let's face it, too much of anything isn't good. Too much water can kill you. But including fruit as a part of a healthy nutritional, balanced diet is the standard by which every "nutritional" expert I've read. "Weight-loss" experts may say differently.

I find it hard to believe that PeerTrainer is promoting the limitation or elimination of fruit. Did I miss something?

Tuesday, April 5, 2011, 8:14 AM

Yes- you missed that Atkins is not a high protein diet. (It's a high fat diet).

You've probably also missed the link between excess carbohydrates and insulin resistance and diabetes, and heart disease, etc., etc..

You've probably also missed things like bell peppers have more vitamin C than oranges. Most of the nutrients you get from fruit can be obtained from eating vegetables- without the excess sugar.

Personally, I don't trust nutritionists at all. Even my mother's endocrinologist has told her not to listen to the nutritionist.

Tuesday, April 5, 2011, 1:59 PM

Hmmmm... trusting an endocrinologist about nutrition above someone who has been educated in nutrition? OK.

I am not saying that there aren't other choices than fruits, but that fruits are a part of a balanced diet. Just like you can substitute soy for meat to get your protein or some vegetables instead of dairy to get your calcium. I'm just saying that I think balance is the key. Cutting out fruits and substituting peppers just doesn't cut it.

From a satisfaction standpoint, I can only eat so much kale and so many peppers. The vegetables that provide vitamin C are far less appealing than fruits. Fruits also offer fiber. It is far easier for me to maintain a healthy diet taht includes fruits than one that does not.

Can you live without fruits? Yes. Can you lie without vegetables? Yes. But living without either seems unbalanced. Why live without either. Just use moderation. That way you get the benefits of all without the excesses of either.

And by the way, Atkins is not a high fat diet.It is a high protein diet / low carb diet that does not focus on fat at all.Because most proteins are higher in fat than vegetable sir fruit, the high fat is just the side benefit ( or curse) from within a high protein diet.

Tuesday, April 5, 2011, 9:02 PM

Uh, The New Atkins for a New You book, as well as the old Diet Revolution generally suggest a diet of no more than 30% protein- which does not make it a high protein diet. 60/30/10, f/p/c, would be high fat, not high protein. The fact is, fat cannot be converted into glucose- protein can. Low carb diets are generally aimed at controlling insulin/blood glucose response, so high protein defeats the purpose when excess protein can be converted to glucose as well.

An endocrinologist is a doctor, who has gone to med school, studied biochemistry, and treats diabetes, and understands hormones. Nutritionists know none of that. They're generally educated in junk science, in degrees that take little time to finish.

Balance according to what? The food pyramid? Also junk (and outdated) science. You need less peppers than orange to get vitamin C. And veggies have more fibre than fruit- so again, your arguments have no real basis besides your feelings. Why live without fruit? Because the nutrtional value is negated by the excess sugar, most of the time. It's really pretty simple.

As the cheat program, and most low carb diets suggest, small amounts of low glycemic fruits (eg- berries) can add variety to a diet. But there is certainly NO NEED for fruit.

Tuesday, April 5, 2011, 11:12 PM

Agreed - you don't need fruit

Just like you don't need meat. What I am saying (and yes, it's how I "feel") is that having a variety in my diet, and that includes fruit, is what helps me to sustain it.

As for my opinion having no basis in fact, there's a lot of controversial information out there, and we each can choose to believe what we will. You may choose to distrust nutritionists because they are not doctors. I choose to trust nutritionists more than doctors because they have specialized expertise and training in nutrition. I choose to eat fruits because they provide vitamins, minerals, fiber and satisfaction that I cannot get from vegetables alone. You choose not to because you find what you need through other sources. Good for you.

Wednesday, April 6, 2011, 4:53 PM

How many points do I need per day to lose 10lbs?

Hi guys! I have been a WW member since 2003 and have lost any weight that I needed to lose throughout the years on Weight Watchers. I have always liked this program but haven't used the NEW Points Plus System, only the FlexPoints System. I have the complete journal, all of the complete food companion and dinner out companion along with all the charts to track my points. Can someone tell me if I need to now go to a meeting just to educate about myself with the new PointsPlus System or is it easy enough to do it on my own? I weigh 140lbs and am 5' 7" tall and would like to lose 5-8 pounds. I know that anything below the weight of 150lbs my height, I should only consume 20 points per day, but since I am below the 150lbs, how many points do I need now to be able to lose the 5-8 more pounds successfully? I greatly appreciate anyone's assistance with this.....Thanks a bunch!

Monday, April 11, 2011, 11:52 AM

You may want to stay teh Flex program

If you want to learn the new program, you really need to go to a meeting and you need to get the new book and calculator because the way they calculate points is completely different. And all you old cookbooks and dining companion? They don't have the right points values for the new program either. So bottom line, you either start all over with new stuff or stick to what you already have and what has worked for you.

I have found the new program a bit easier because fruits are free, but some of the low point foods I used to like now have a higher points value. But you get more points too (29 id the bottom.). A glass of wine went from 2 to 4 points and WW yogurts from 1 to 2, for instance

Wednesday, April 13, 2011, 10:35 AM

If you can't get to a meeting you can join online

Thursday, April 14, 2011, 7:08 AM

PointsPlus calculation

I'm giving the new WW plan a shot (online anyway; I'm not doing the meetings) - I'm a first timer on WW but after years on PeerTrainer somehow 10 pounds crept back (2010 was a doozy in every aspect for me and my jeans show it!). As a Dr. Fuhrman believer the new points plus system makes absolute sense to me and I find I can be very full on just 17 points per day (since most veggies and fruits are 0 points and I eat things like beans and ground flaxseed a la Eat to Live). That being said the weight is coming off soooo slooowly that I will probably need to re-examine my fruit intake in the next week or so if I don't get some more traction.

But (finally) to answer some PPs' questions:
1) 29 is the lowerst daily point allocation with the new plan (vs. lower values in the previous plan); you also get 49 flex points per week (or at least I do: 5'6", starting weight 144 lbs). The points are higher because some foods have higher values now vs. the other plan (mainly foods with high fat/carbs or empty calories, like alcohol) and they are assuming you're going to be eating lots of 0 point foods so they've taken this into account by increasing your daily points.
2) Here's how you calculate points with the new plan: 1 Points Plus = (Protein grams / 10.9) + (Carbohydrate grams / 9.2) + (Fat grams / 3.9) + (Fiber grams / 35).

Or if you're a WW online member there's a calculator on their site you can use.

Hope this is helpful!

Wednesday, April 27, 2011, 4:54 PM

4:45 p.s.

I should add that I'm usually using my full 29 points, not 17 points. I think the most likely culprit for the slow weight loss is me relying on my activity points (still about 100 calories burned = 1 activity point) to offset some special event food overages I had the last week or two - not the fruit! But I am currently testing this theory (by staying on plan re: food and trying not to rely on activity points for the next few weeks).

Wednesday, April 27, 2011, 4:57 PM

Momentum

I just switched back to momentum as today as well. I also found that I was starving on the PointsPlus. I hope I do as well as you! I actually had an old spreadsheet from Momentum, so I calculated the exact same food I at on Points Plus. On Points Plus I used 45 per day, on momentum it was 35! No freakin wonder I was starving! I eat very heathy too: BK; vitatop, greek yogurt, blueberries, LUNCH; tuna sandwich loaded with veggies, DINNER: Turkey with spinach and potatoes, SNACKS: rice cake with yogurt and berries, DESSERT; Edys light ice cream 1/2 c. This is how you should be eating long term. But because the 2 slices of bread, 1 med potato and 1/2 cup of ice cream I at were more carby, PP whapped me upside the head. Your not gonna tell me that people will go their whole lifes without eating bread, ice cream or potatoes! Momentum had it right, WW screwed up!

Thursday, June 23, 2011, 9:57 AM

I'm all for doing whatever works for people and their goals, because there is no one way to lose weight. To that end, WW didn't screw up - its new program just focuses on nutritional density, which may not suit everyone. Some people are just not wiling to give up certain things, and that's fine, but that's not a flaw in the program. They even give you a truckload of extra points to use through out the week so no one ever has to permanently eliminate anything from their diet.

Thursday, June 23, 2011, 10:41 AM

What now with my points

Thank you for all the useful information everybody shared!! Maybe you can cast some light on this:
I have done the WW points system to get to goal and have maintained my weight for the last 2 years - I am 5 foot 3 and weigh around 105lbs. I managed to get to goal by keeping to 20 points a day for the whole time to lose ~20lbs and didn't adjust it up or down since I was losing fine. I also did 3x20 minute runs per week but didn't add points nor did I add any flex poins (you mention 35 for the week). During the 2 years of maintenance I still stuck to 20 points. I would like to add some points now since overcoming the fear of gaining weight again. I still exercise regularly a week and starting to up the routine quite a bit (4x1 hours of gym/week). The 20 points really worked for me to lose/maintain for how long. Still a bit scared to adjust it. To how much per day should I adjust it and how much weekly flex points must I add on top of this (keep in mind that I did not add this before)?

Wednesday, July 13, 2011, 8:59 AM

What now with my Points (part 2)

To note regarding above: I am referring to the old points program as I only have that one.

My question again:

Thank you for all the useful information everybody shared!! Maybe you can cast some light on this:
I have done the WW points system to get to goal and have maintained my weight for the last 2 years - I am 5 foot 3 and weigh around 105lbs. I managed to get to goal by keeping to 20 points a day for the whole time to lose ~20lbs and didn't adjust it up or down since I was losing fine. I also did 3x20 minute runs per week but didn't add points nor did I add any flex poins (you mention 35 for the week). During the 2 years of maintenance I still stuck to 20 points. I would like to add some points now since overcoming the fear of gaining weight again. I still exercise regularly a week and starting to up the routine quite a bit (4x1 hours of gym/week). The 20 points really worked for me to lose/maintain for how long. Still a bit scared to adjust it. To how much per day should I adjust it and how much weekly flex points must I add on top of this (keep in mind that I did not add this before)?

Wednesday, July 13, 2011, 9:11 AM

My thought as a weight watcher member currently on the program and still losing weight but not at my goal-I would go to a meeting and talk to the leader since she or he is also a lifetime member and has keep weight off. Meetings are made up of members like me and also lifetime members and are helpful too! Just a thought!

Wednesday, July 13, 2011, 9:39 AM

"This is how you should be eating long term. But because the 2 slices of bread, 1 med potato and 1/2 cup of ice cream I at were more carby, PP whapped me upside the head. Your not gonna tell me that people will go their whole lifes without eating bread, ice cream or potatoes! Momentum had it right, WW screwed up! "

WW may have upset your carb addiction- seems like someone needed to knock some sense into you.

Monday, August 1, 2011, 8:52 AM

Adding Points

If you are maintaining at 20 Points (old program) then adding points will likely cause you to gain unless you also add activity. The rule of thumb with the old program was to increase by 4 points, then see what happens. If you continue to lose, add more, if you start to gain, subtract a few until you find the right #. Seems like you already have it and it's 20.

I have been trying the new program but am still not sure it works well for me. I find that I am far less hungry on the new program in part because of the free fruit. But I also don't think I lose as well. I exercise a lot and generally use my activity points, but I did the same with the old program. I may need to think about ignoring the actvity points

Tuesday, August 2, 2011, 10:56 AM

How many Weekly Points?

April 27, 4:54 or anyone

You get 45 weekly points? I didn't know the weekly points changed. I thought it was still 35. How do you determine how many weekly points you should get?

Tuesday, August 2, 2011, 11:00 AM

To "Adding Points"

Thank you very much for your insights! Appreciate your response! Would love your advice on this: I'm doing the Body For Life Program now which is much more exercise (tweaked to 4 days per week of 20 minutes on the treadmill and 45 minutes weights). Do you think 22 points/day (will not include any additional activity points or flex points on top of this but stick to 22 only) will be fine for me to lose (I've gained about 3kgs lately since I changed to a different way of eating due to the increased appetite)? Or should I go back to my standard 20 points until I lose the weight and only then start adding more points to maintain? I don't want to eat too little and mess up my metabolism when I'm exercising more.

My original post:

On the old points (1-2-3 success). Thank you for all the useful information everybody shared!! Maybe you can cast some light on this:
I have done the WW points system to get to goal and have maintained my weight for the last 2 years - I am 5 foot 3 and weigh around 105lbs. I managed to get to goal by keeping to 20 points a day for the whole time to lose ~20lbs and didn't adjust it up or down since I was losing fine. I also did 3x20 minute runs per week but didn't add points nor did I add any flex poins (you mention 35 for the week). During the 2 years of maintenance I still stuck to 20 points. I would like to add some points now since overcoming the fear of gaining weight again. I still exercise regularly a week and starting to up the routine quite a bit (4x1 hours of gym/week). The 20 points really worked for me to lose/maintain for how long. Still a bit scared to adjust it. To how much per day should I adjust it and how much weekly flex points must I add on top of this (keep in mind that I did not add this before)?

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